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Submitted by: dunno source via Submit a Kludge!
I can’t help but think it’s stuff like this that will start our downward spiral towards The Matrix. – Ms. Fix-It
Favorite Comment: Fixer AZack says, “We are USBorg. Resistance is futile.”
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Resistance is futile…
That’s the least of his problems. The main issue is that futility is resistant.
That just made my day. I think it should say, “Futility is resistant” under the title of this website.
sooooo much what I where gonna write..
All praises to whoever did that if it actually works
Definetly agree.
Yeah, assuming that works, it is a work of manifest genius.
It does work – USB keyboards and mice are pin compatible with PS/2 (the round plug), which means that all you need to do to convert from one to the other is to connect the right leads on the USB plug to the right places in the PS/2 socket. They even sell little adapters that’ll do that for you – for a while, a couple of years ago, almost every USB keyboard or mouse came with one. They’re literally exactly this, just packaged more nicely.
aye, but the fiddly thing about that is getting the wires at the right place
USB is for the weak! xD
That’s exactly why this is on this site. They sell adapters for, like, $2.00.
Absolutely the best kludge I have seen in some time.
It could work, but this implementation likely won’t – theres 6 wires in the picture which implies it is just for show as there are only 4 wires in a USB port. 5v + and ground to run the keyboard electronics, then data + and – which carries the keypresses.
I suppose there might be two ground lines, both of them attached to the metal shield of the plug?
One assumes this guy is REALLY short of USB cables (dunno how, I’ve got scores of them, all having been delivered with now-obsolete/broken/can-only-use-one-at-a-time items), otherwise the easier way would have been to chop off the plug, strip the internal wires back a bit, and poke them into the appropriate socket holes. I think I’ve done something similar with a different cable (9-pin serial mouse?) before when the cable’s broken a little way back from the plug.
(damn that’s going to bug me all day now. or maybe it was a kludgey adaption of an old 5-pin DIN stereo output to 2x RCA?)
Oh and NOT “all” USB keyboards and mice are compatible. They have to have the correct circuitry – when you plug them into a USB socket, they recognise the different signalling and switch into native USB mode; it’s only when this is absent and much slower PS2 (basically modified RS232, as was the old AT socket and of course the serial mouse, which is why PS2/serial adaptors also work) signalling is present does it send compatible signals to them.
Which is why the adaptor to plug in PS2 devices to my USB-only laptop has a nice big lump halfway along with a converter chip in it – the USB socket can’t accept PS2 signalling.
With luck, bare-wiring it will preserve whatever is required for this mode switch.
cool story bro
Well, it’s a little more involved than that. USB and PS/2 are not compatible; they use different signals and different protocols. But quite a few keyboards and mice use an interface chip that can sense if it’s connected to a PS/2 port or an USB port, and switch their signals accordingly. That little USB-to-PS/2 doohickey you get with them is just the bunch of wires you see here, packaged in a bit of plastic with the right connectors on the end. The keyboard/mouse cable usually ends in an USB plug, and the adapter has an USB socket and a PS/2 plug.
If you were to use one of these ‘backwards’, as it were (with a couple of gender changers on both sides) to hook up any old keyboard or mouse with a PS/2 connector to an USB bus, you’ll find it won’t work because while you now have the thing connected, the keyboard/mouse still doesn’t ‘speak’ USB. There are adapters that do that, usually with 2 PS/2 sockets (for mouse and keyboard).
ya stuff 6 wires into a connector with 4 contacts… epic FAIL!
You have to wire one of the usb contact to more than one hole in this.
Hey treborx, next time do your homework before you declare something to be FAIL!
There’s 5 pins on a USB A connector, not 4.
Pin 1 VCC
Pin 2 D-
Pin 3 D+
Pin 4 ID
Pin 5 GND
While there are six pins on a PS/2 port, pins 2 and 6 aren’t actually carrying a signal because they’re not soldered to anything.
Pin 1 +DATA
Pin 2 Not connected
Pin 3 GND
Pin 4 Vcc +5 V DC at 275 mA
Pin 5 +CLK
Pin 6 Not connected
ID is found on motherboard headers, it doesn’t actually do anything… noob
Probably just reading a pinout diagram. The basic point is still accurate enough for the purposes of the post.
It’s Sarge. He proclaims himself to be a computer technician, but he can’t even count the number of contacts in an USB A plug, nor does he know about dual-mode (USB-PS/2) keyboards and mice.
So… if 4, 5, or 6 pins are needed (depending on who you ask)
Why are there 7 wires connecting the two in the photo?
Actually a USB A has 4 contacts. The shield/shell isn’t usually considered a pin. Mini A/B have a fifth pin “x”. It can be used to inform the device what it’s hooked to.
While a USB cable might leave the x pin floating, a phone charger might pull it to 5V to inform that phone that it can pull more than 50/500mA from the cable and charge faster than it could/should when plugged into a PC USB port (which can/should supply only 50/500mA).
Yeah, and I see 7 wires…
And it would be virtually impossible to stick seven wires into an A connector without them shorting to each other or the shield…
No hot glue? No duct tape?
I’ll try to believe it really works and isn’t a fake…
Ok, I tried. Didn’t work.
Pull out your thumb drive, look at it, how many leads are there on it?
4?
Ok. Now take a usb cable, cut it, strip it back, how many individual wires are in there? 4?
So, then the question is why are there 6 wires in this picture?
I’ve looked at half a dozen thumb drives and 3 or 4 different USB cables to confirm this – and I’ve cut my fair share of usb cables open. I’ve never seen one with more than 4 wires.
So explain the “5 pins on a USB A connector” to me. One of them doesn’t go anywhere.
And there are still 6 wires in this picture. If there are only 4 active pins on a PS/2 port, why the extra two wires, anyhow?
A ground wire counts as a pin, whether or not you think it does.
I’ve come across many USB products that WILL NOT RUN if the ground pin (the “plug shield” as everyone keeps calling it) is not connected.
A cheap hack is to bridge the ground plane to the ID pin. Not always recommended.
So everyone calling BS on the USB connector being wired directly into a PS/2 port are actually the ones who don’t know what they’re talking about.
PS/2 is *PIN FOR PIN* compatible with USB. Open up an adapter sometime. Nothing but wires inside.
I even built myself a USB charger by cutting the PS/2 cable off an old keyboard. Wired the 5v and ground wire to the 5v and ID wire of a female end of a USB extension cord. No data, but the voltage is the same and it charges my mp3 player just dandy.
Well, actually if you cut a USB cable (at least with the mouse that I took apart) there are 5 pins (2x GND; 1x D+, D-, +5V)
FAIL.
Look at ANY USB A connector. Four, 4, contact fingers, not counting the shield. Look at the USB 2.0/1.1 spec: VCC, D-, D+, GND. Count’em. Four.
EPIC!!!!! guess people don’t know how many pins are on a USB connector. I’m calling BS on this on too!!
It depends what TYPE of USB it is.
As noted, plain USB A/B has 4 contact strips, plus a conceptual fifth for the shield (which counts as a pin for most AV connectors (RCA, SCART, etc) but not others like… well, almost all PC ones). Some mini USBs have a fifth pin, and there’s some wierd ass proprietary ones with six. USB+power is six, but that’s generally with a piggyback second connector and a larger socket to accomodate it. USB 3.0 has 8… all in the existing A plug, or in a modified B plug.
But a single-device PS2 only uses 4 of its pins, as it there is also a standard 2-device variant that uses all 6 (kb+mouse at once, eg on laptops) – the power and clock lines are shared and only the signalling ones seperate. So you’d only need 4 to go between the PS2 and USB. Presumably this means a Mac keyboard is incompatible with the “it’s just an etched board in a plastic shell” USB/PS2 converters because a/ Macs have never used that standard, B/ it’s got a couple of passthru ports on the back, into which is typically plugged the mouse (leaving one free for memory sticks etc).
This picture strikes me as something from the annals of “IT Tech Support Horror Stories”. I haven’t seen as bad as this, but a few that have come close. Including of course the classic “my memory stick won’t fit in the USB port….” where the hole they were jamming it in proves to be something else entirely. Which is now broken. As is the memory stick. Some people just don’t get the hint that if what you’re pushing your device into is so resistant to the idea that it’s cracking the case, it’s probably not what you were after. For heaven’s sake don’t let them loose in a pick-up bar…
We are USBorg. Resistance is futile.
My thoughts exactly. Win!
USBorg = American Borg?
No…. Universal Serial Borg
why so serial?
In this case, Universal Serial Bodge.
Lower your shields and surrender your data. Your casing will be adapted to service us. Your hardware and software will be added to our own.
It can work. That looks like it might be one of the inexpensive Logitech mice, which can work in PS/2 mode with an adapter included in the box, this is just senseless as it’s probably only $2 to get a proper adapter. I keep several of these Logitech mice as spares.
The silly thing is that buying these is only $10 at a local Wal-Mart, including the adapter. A kluge like might damage the computer if you short some wires. Killing a computer to save $10 – priceless.
$2? Hell, I have a good 7 or 8 laying around my room. Almost as many DVI-VGA converters too :p
I agree wholeheartedly. Plus, it doesn’t look like it actually works. The wires going into the male USB would need to be soldered to the pads, which aren’t wide enough to accomodate more than one wire, especially of the larger gauge they used. The male USB is part of an encased adaptor, which would have to be taken apart to do the soldering.
The other end of the adaptor looks like it could be a PS/2 connector, which would defeat the purpose of this kludge to begin with. More than anything, though, is that the weight of all that, pulling on the wires, I think it would be easy for the wires to pull out of the motherboard PS/2 socket.
Gawd, give me the dude’s address, we’re swimming with these things at work.
(every mouse is usb and comes with an adaptor… but is used with PCs that on the whole only have usb sockets now… so they just end up floating around getting in the way. Probably got 10 of them in my junkbox)
trancievers for that are a dime-a-dozen. It’s when you can go backwards (usb-ps2) that I’ll be impressed.
and by that I mean (ps2–>usb)
You mean use a PS2 keyboard & mouse in a USB port? That requires electronics to do the conversion, but they exist. Example:
http://www.amazon.com/Link-Depot-USB-PS2-Keyboard-adapter/dp/B000GX3VHK
Ummm… Isn’t USB usually a four-pin connector? This photo confuses me greatly.
Yeah, and why is it in the keyboard port, I have a bunch of green USB to PS/2 mouse adaptors but no purple for keyboards
I’m fairly certain they’re the exact same thing, I’ve got both and used them interchangeably for years.
I have both green and purple ones, as well as ones that are not colour-coded (same putty colour as the rest of the adapter). It doesn’t matter which is used – they both have the same pins – as long as you plug the keyboard or mouse into the correct corresponding PS/2 port.
USB>PS/2 adapters do exist, and I suppose that they would be very much the same as in the photo, only encased in a nice and neat little plastic little gadget, but the basic principles would still apply — have wires leading from the correct contacts into the correct ports.
To be honest, an adapter would have worked much easier, and doesn’t really cost that much. Sadly, though, this kludge is a _keyboard_ and not a mouse.
For some reason, mouse USB>PS/2 adapters do not seem to work on Keyboards for some Odd reason. At least, I could never get one to work.
What the person in the photo should have done, was kludge the mouse instead of the KB (they obviously have a USB mouse plugged into a USB port…), as mice seem a bit more tolerant of that than keyboards are.
Unless, of course, this is a *really* old computer that does not have USB Keyboard support in its BIOS.
There is no way this can work.
USB differs from PS2 not by just wiring, it also has a complex and terribly overengineered protocol. You need some appliance to decode/encode USB signals and put them into PS2.
PS2RS232 adapters, though, are pretty simple.
It can, and usually will work, because suitable keyboards/mice will sense whether they’re connected to USB or a PS/2 port, and change its signalling accordingly.
The typical USB>PS/2 adapters are only the the connections with no intelligence whatsoever. Since the protocols are entirely different the device itself must detect the connection and use the right protocol.
i.e. you can use such an adapter only if the mouse or keyboard talks both USB and PS/2. Not every device does that.
Dual standard keyboards may not be as common, but I have a couple of them.
I have a Logitech Keyboard that has a special keyboard USB/PS2 adapter, its purple (matching std color schemes) so while the mice adapters might not work for keyboards there are special adapters (or maybe its on the keyboard side) out there that work.
To clarify what other have been saying, those little green adaptors don’t translate from the USB protocol to the PS/2 family of on-wire protocols. They’re “passive adaptors”. (They just make the appropriate electrical connections)
As such, they only work with mice that know how to recognize the different electrical pinouts of the two connectors and speak either PS/2 or USB as necessary.
Few (but apparently some) keyboards have similar functionality.
The USB adapter for ps/2 Keyboards do exist and work very well… You just to make sure you get the right ones… They are colour coded. The Green ones we all have in the backs of drawers (or threw away) are for mice and MICE ONLY. The BLUE or PURPLE ones are for KEYBOARDS…. They are just as easy to find… you just need to know what you are asking for…. My hat is off to this guy for doing it by hand!! He is probably running Windows NT or 95 ( with NO USB support!!
After 2 hours of setup with the cords you finally got it working.
This called for a celebration beer but at the same time you opened that ice cold beer your lovely wife’s voice calls out:
-”Hey, I’d just vacuumed behind the computer!”
…This only raises the questions of what he’s trying to plug in, and what else he’s already plugged in to make this necessary. Let’s just hope the computer in this shot isn’t something like the main control unit for the LHC. Though that WOULD explain all the delays…
yeah, one of the worlds most complex machines delays would solely be attributed to something like this kludge. Next time you try and be funny, add some intelligence.
The Borg began as a small experiment in Alex’s basement bedroom, and grew from there.
I used to have a mouse that came with an adapter that converted the USB connector to PS/2. It depends on whether the keyboard (I’m guessing that its a keyboard, as it could be something else knowing this site) has the logic to support both protocols.
Somehow, I don’t see this working very well; both USB and PS/2 only use four pins for data, clock, ground, Vcc, etc..
A bit of heat-shrink tubing it it would even hide this fine kludge!
Not to be confused with a harmless and inanimate USB, the Unholy SuccuBus is a different creature entirely and should be avoided at all costs. Its appearance allows it to blend in with the other cords perfectly. It seduces the computer into thinking there will be an enjoyable plug ‘n’ play experience for both parties. It then attaches its tendrils to its unwitting victim, draining it of energy and information.
I’d like to see a manual on how to distinguish between innocent USB from its hideous cousins you described…
Have a question to the expert though. Do these bad USB suckers feed on human blood as well, or just electricity? I feel very strange lately, working late hours makes me feel so week, everything is getting blurred, I… feel… so… wee
Only electronic equipment kneads two fear this dreaded monster. What ewe are experiencing seems too bee effects of a long work weak. Their are only to more days until the weakend. Then, ewe can rest up and knot feel sew week. Until then, calfeine is your friend.
Calfeine up-lied, thunk you vary match. It hellped
Okay I looked up the diagrams for PS/2 and USB. PS/2 in fact only uses 4 of its 6 pins so the number of pins match up. But what baffles me is PS/2 has a CLK pin and a DATA+ pin, where USB has a DATA+ pin and a DATA- pin. I assume that the CLK pin isn’t needed for a USB device that probably has an internal clock or just doesn’t give a flying ****. I suppose if USB doesn’t require DATA- in that a USB mouse really only needs to broadcast data then this IS doable. Being that these adapters do exist (I have one and it doesn’t look like it contains any circuitry) then I say this works and you don’t even need a driver for it to work.
Oh and I don’t think this person knew what they were doing since 2 of those wires do absolutely nothing
aaaaaaaaw, you passed!
Now you can build a helicopter.
But can he/she build a roflcopter?
USB keyboards and mice usually have dual protocols for either USB or PS/2
the PS/2 ports are completely different from USB the adaptors that come with those devices just reroute the signals eg clock and data from the PS/2 port to the data + – rails on the device and the device figures this out and starts talking PS/2, dont try this with almost any other USB device as the PS/2 port is for the keyboard and mouse and is legacy (eg usable from dos and the local hardware)
nice photo, but i highly doubt this worked
There are some mice or keyboards which implement both USB and PS/2 standards. Those usually come with adapters for USB –> PS/2.
Different manufactorers have different adapters, and a mouse / keyboard which does not support this feature will not work with such an adapter, made by a factory or handmade.
But a mouse that shipped with such an adapter will most likely work with something like that, assuming you get the connections right.
this is great work by someone, but way too much work – just buy an adaptor.
Why is there no power supply? Is this a setup?
It’s a test rig for the new Wireless Power Supply.
It’s a dog old computer from the looks of it. Only a few USB ports and it has a real parallel port. I haven’t seen a motherboard back panel like that in years.
Modern keyboards can handle usb or ps/2 with an adapter to handle situations just like this. It very likely worked, but would be sensitive to any movement of the cables that may yank out a wire.
It appears to have 4 USB ports (common on modern medium end computers) Even the computer I just bought brand new has a parallel port as well.
We’ve got PCs here that are under 2 years old with PS2 + Parallel ports on, and they hadn’t long retired the serial socket to just being a header on the mobo (though there’s still space for it on the back panel – penny pinching, eh!) – a pain in the backside as we still have some RS232-based interactive whiteboards, and now have to make the choice between $30 USB-COM adaptors (and jerry rigging up a replacement for the 5v power line which is rarely properly implemented) or even more expensive COM header ports on low-profile brackets. Nevermind that the parts cost a tiny fraction of that, if we had the patience to make the thing up from scratch.
Still got one more of the older “traditional” (PS2 + serial + parallel + 4 USB) machines to replace on a serial board… so one more potential opportunity for *grits teeth* “fun” making the transition. But thankfully after that, all done, and the newer (larger, higher rez projectors) boards are all USB. Which probably means we’ll be repeating this happy process in another 10-15 years or so when USB is old hat and we’re all using gamma-laser fibre optics and terabit wireless or something, but the less bleeding-edge hardware that doesn’t get thrown away through obsolescence (touch boards basically don’t ever break down, reached their more-or-less practical maximum size last year, and are unlikely to ever need a raw data rate above a couple thousand bits per second) is still hanging about. I wonder if we’d be able to successfully cascade New Connection Method to USB to Serial, even? (I’ve done AT keyboard > PS2 > USB already). Or even go direct – there’s a lot of BRAND NEW devices that still have RS232 control input capability.
The slightly newer machines – maybe a year old – have gone over to USB-only (and often, even more annoyingly, DVI-only… guess how much DVI equipment we have vs VGA? It’s about a 1:100 ratio. More bulky, pricey converters for us to save the manufacturer a little money that isn’t passed on in the purchase price anyway). Not sure what kind of cutting edge environment you’re living in where this sort of thing hasn’t been around for an age. Unless you’ve only been using laptops and ITXs or something.
in case anyone pulls me up on it btw – yes, the projectors do break down or at least wear out / become obsolete (still got a brace of SVGA ones, Windows XP looks like hell with them, and the picture quality is slowly fading) – but they’re quite easily replacable parts, and I’ve swapped enough of them thus far. The actual touch part of the thing is nigh on indestructable short of some cretin attacking it with a knife.
Where *are* people seeing actual USB ports in this pic, anyway? I see the keyboard and mouse PS/2 connectors, a serial port, a parallel port, the power connector…and some other plug underneath the power connector, which could in theory be a USB cord, but there’s not enough of it visible to tell what it actually is.
I’m really curious as to whether this worked.
Look! Swimming goggles in the background!
This perfectly captures the essence of this website. I can picture the user, cursing softly at first while searching the computer, then cursing loudly and wondering aloud “what computer DOESN’T have USB?! sdaslkdjadflffaaaahhkk!!” …until the need was so desperate, that the user kludged this together over 1hr+, finally exclaiming “THERE, I FIXED IT!” and cackling loudly as his device came to life with that ubiquitous “guh-DUNK” sound from the computer.
Sure the keyboard works, but with no power supply, this computer isn’t doing any typing soon.
Just because it’s not at its assigned location, it doesn’t mean it’s not connected. I have had a machine for a year that had its PSU placed on the top of the case.
Why are all of you still using computers? They are so ’15 minutes ago’
Come to the future!
See how the usb feeds off of the unevolved, female counterpart. yes, I did just make fun of this by mixing it with an animal show.
And here is the U-S-Bee, a pollinating the much larger, sedentary Desktop Flower, and obtaining nutritious electricity in return.
uh, ever hear of a USB hub? I see that this thing actually has USB ports on it.
Alternate theory: maybe it’s not a keyboard being attached tot he keyboard port. It could be some dedicated machine that is waiting for something like “press any key”, and the usb cord is going to some device that will react to a real-world event.
I built something like this to automatically stop a recording program when the arm of the record player got to the middle. I had a joystick port available, so I coded to that instead of the keyboard.
Welcome to the TIFI computer hardware support forum! Our next post comes from Charlie in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, who needs some advice on where to find drivers for his Logitech serial mouse, using a Windows 98 operating system.
Drivers are on the Internet.
It won’t work. There is no power supply in the computer
(and no kludge with 2 lab power supplies and a car battery either)
Wanna bet it’s on the desk? The right side case panel is off.
There’s a hack for that.
Men are from Mars. Women are from Venus. Computers are from hell.
This is a prime example of the world domination of USB, as if its own conectors weren’t enough, they adapted themselves to force other connector to accept their “input”.
The question is, as this computer seems to have four, fully-occupied USB ports … what else has this person got also plugged in to the USB lines that are more important than a decent connection for the keyboard? Or getting a hub?
This is why it’s called a kludge, and makes it to the front page
100TH!!!!!11
there are actually 7 wires in the picture. he/she stuck a wire where that plastic rectangle goes.
so the wires could be arranged like 1n2n3n4 so the no connection wires (n) are separating the 4 important wires from each other.
ummmmmmm You PC guys really are nerds!!! I didn’t believe it until I saw it for myself!
Typical hardware Key-Logger avoid procedure. Trained by CIA? NSA?
entirely too many serious nerds responding to this kludge. Rather than a serious fix-it, I believe it’s a nerd magnet, and it works! The nefarious plan is to gather all those brainy types, kidnap them, and enslave them to work for an overseas company that plans on World Domination……..oh wait, many of them probably already do that……